The "New" way to pretend with the Endangered Species Act

Spaslab

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The Mountain Lion Foundation just found a new way to play games with the Endangered Species Act. They have proposed that the mountain lion is an endangered animal in a specific area. It is not endangered throughout the rest of it's range, far from it. Lions could be brought in via tranquilizer and truck but that is beside their point.

From their Facebook Page:

In December 2017, a “three-strike” policy was implemented by the California Department of Fish and Wildlife (CDFW). In the Santa Monica and Santa Ana Mountains, lions are isolated due to habitat fragmentation and are at-risk of extinction. The policy, which adds protection for mountain lions in the Santa Ana and Santa Monica ranges, requires property owners in the area to use non-lethal methods of deterrence before a depredation permit can be issued.

Unfortunately, the protection of the “three-strike” policy does not go far enough. Scientific research published in December 2018 and in March 2019 showed the genetic isolation of Southern California's mountain lion populations and predicted that if inbreeding depression occurs, the lions in the Santa Ana Mountains could go extinct within 12 years and those in the Santa Monica Mountains within 15 years.
In a partnership with the Center for Biological Diversity we are petitioning CDFW to list mountain lions in the Southern and Central Coast areas of California as “threatened” or “endangered” in accordance with the California Endangered Species Act.
This is our best hope for saving mountain lions in the Santa Ana and Santa Monica Mountains!


I live in Simi, currently one of the hot spots for lion human interactions and was a consultant involved with a ranch that has a bad lion problem. I placed cameras and drew a map showing predatory pathways, and extent of predator time on site. This is nuts. If they build that wildlife corridor they are planning, they will have a bunch of cats from the Simi area crossing over. All this does is try to make it even more impossible to get rid of a cat that has developed bad habits, which some lions are going to do. These people don't want to live with the predators, and accept them for what they are, they refuse to accept them for what they are. Some are going to need to be chased by hounds and treed to learn to teach their kittens not to mess with people. It was just so stupid to outlaw hound hunting of them. They could have made specific quotas or given houndsmen a certain number of hazings that had to be completed per tag. This is a creepy new way of dumping more legal obstacles on people who will have to deal with these animals in one way or another. What a ridiculous slippery slope...
 

photohunter

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The ESA is BS now because the process to delist a species isn't being followed as written. States follow the rules and then judges override based on their own beliefs rather than follow the law.
 

Spaslab

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Yup. Now in the press the bald eagles are being lead poisoned all across the United States. Just like they supposedly are here in CA. But but bu...there was that disturbing finding that many of our Condors were being poisoned by the old lead filled pipes that were pumping water out to the water troughs. Not from bullets. Now they are dying from micro trash...the new lead poisoning?

It just doesn't end. This feel good everyone gets an opinion nonsense is not a way to try to manage wildlife. When we leave it up to public feelings instead of field scientists we are going to run into this every single time...Lions in suburban neighborhoods, smaller and smaller localized deer populations, huge tracks of land locked away from the public and no increase in bird populations...

Nonlead ammunition that is horribly inaccurate under .30 caliber...just picking away every day....getting nothing done except loss of rights.
 

Spaslab

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None of it is about sound wildlife decisions. Watch us United States! See the future of giving an inch. Don't give a damn millimeter.
 

BOWUNTR

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I say let them do it... you'll never be able to hunt them anyways. Let California be the test for all things gone bad so others will understand sound wildlife management. Ed F
 

Spaslab

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LOL. I have been collecting scat from the local cats in the Simi hills and turning it in to a vet tech who analyzes it for parasites (that is her avocation) for the last 2 years. I find scratchings, toilets, prints, scats, fur, pieces of last night's dinner. My wife rides horses, and sometimes her mare will react oddly when on a residential trail 1/4 to 1/2 mile in from the hills. Always find scat, pee, scratchings. Her mare does not like the smell of large predators having recently fed in an area. She knows.

So what happens here is they tranq a cat (the vet tech has video of the one they tranq'd in her neighbor's tree) after they tree it then relocate it back up in he hills, some say behind Challenger Park where I walk my dogs. The cats don't like this process so they stay low profile for a few days then begin following their noses to the chicken coops, goat pens, etc.

Your pic made me laugh cuz it was taken where cats belong. I am finding the further into the hills I go the less sign there is. The closer to the houses, the more sign. These things are following drainage culverts and horse paths way into a suburban city with a population of 125K people, and prowling for house pets (north east end of town by Rocky Peak fantastic bedding areas but less forage, and the south side of town, equestrian with lots of 4 H animals, good forage, less bedding areas).

I don't know how to convey to the rest of the world that what you discuss, us showing the rest of the states how this is not a good idea...well that is not coming...it is here!
 

BOWUNTR

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I listened to a podcast with a wildlife biologist who studies lions... he's also a houndsman. Lots of time spent in the cat woods. He explained it simply... the lion populations are balanced by the avaliable habit and most importantly, food.

I don't think that there are many more lions in California today then when I started hunting there over 30 years ago. I saw 6 or 7 lions in the field while hunting California. I've seen 6 in four years here in Arizona, not counting the ones I've seen hunting with hounds. I've killed 3 in the last 3 years.

I believe the difference is the food. Az has managed healthy, well balanced wild food populations for the lions. California does not... Lions are encroaching on suburban areas where the food is... dogs, cats, sometimes people... So, what I'm saying is that California lions are not overpopulated, they are just searching for food. California has done a super terrible job at managing it's wildlife that there is no other choice for the lions. Mismanagement or no management is a totally different topic. Ed F
 
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