Long Beard XR

fish dog

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Yep... (from http://californiaoutdoorsqas.com/ )



Are the new Winchester XR turkey loads legal in California?
Question: Winchester has introduced new turkey ammo that is getting good reviews and I would like to try them out but they use a system that encapsulates the shot and therefore the shot is not “loose in the shell”. Does this make this type of ammo illegal? What is the purpose of having the shot loose in the shell? (Jim C.)
Answer: This ammo is not legal because the law requires that all shot must be loose in the shell. So if the shot is encapsulated as you describe, then it is considered a slug. The specific section says, “Shotgun shells may not be used or possessed that contain shot size larger than No. BB, except that shot size larger than No. 2 may not be used or possessed when taking wild turkey. All shot shall be loose in the shell” (California Code of Regulations Title 14, section 311(b)).
While this product violates the letter of the law today, this language was put into place originally for another specific purpose. It was to address a problem in the days of lead shot where buck shot would be wired together with piano wire and to prevent people from coming up with a way to turn shot into a slug (e.g. melted lead, rusted steel, etc.). In the future, these regulations may be rewritten to allow this type of ammunition, but as of now it is still a violation of the law and so you could be cited for using it.
 

TonyS

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it would sort be like hitting a turkey with a .50 cal muzzleloader wouldn't it? Destroy the meat and cause a big puff of feathers.
 

sportyg

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No the shot does separate. It is an issue with the way it is cased in the shell. you can buy it and shoot it here just can't hunt with it. At lest not turkey.
 

Phil

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I wanted to test the Winchester Long Beard ammo by patterning it at different yardages. It does pattern well out to 40 yards for me in my Beretta A400. This pattern was shot at 20 yards and 40 yds
 

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ilovesprig

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My question is......Why shoot that stuff that costs 6 bucks a shell? When lead is just as good, if not better at a little over a dollar a shell.

My daughters 20 gauge....25 yds, lead, 3" 1 1/4 ounces of 6's.

Phil......This was your pattern.......Wasn't this Kent lead 3", 5's at 30 yds?

.
 

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outdoorplay

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ilovesprig said:
My question is......Why shoot that stuff that costs 6 bucks a shell? When lead is just as good, if not better at a little over a dollar a shell.

My daughters 20 gauge....25 yds, lead, 3" 1 1/4 ounces of 6's.

Phil......This was your pattern.......Wasn't this Kent lead 3", 5's at 30 yds?

.
Im with Steve, I like 6's or 7's, one shot to the head and there are done
 

Phil

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The Kent Diamond loads worked great with the SBE II and the Primos Jellyhead choke. The Beretta A400 is still fairly new and there aren't many turkey chokes available for it. Here's the Kent Diamond pattern fired from my Beretta.
 

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ilovesprig

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Phil,

Were those 3" or 3 1/2"?........I really like Kent Diamond shot turkey loads.......There just hard to find.
 

longbeard55

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There are some areas of California where we cant use lead any more. Soon to be the whole state. Lead works just fine for me and has taken most of my turkeys. I prefer lead instead of expensive non lead but what can we do. We have Gov moonbeam and a liberal state legislature.
 

outdoorplay

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They are sueing the state for the lead ban, as their own studies proved no condor has ever died from lead poisoning. They hid the results of the testing to mislead the public. We as hunters need to make things like that VERY PUBLIC, and make sure those with any kind of involvement get fired and prosecuted.
 
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